Outside of Gaza, I think Biden has done a surprisingly good job. A lot of shit landed on his plate and he’s dealt with it better than most presidents would have.
And while he may not be as progressive as many progressives would like him to be, I feel he’s been more progressive than most ever expected him to be…which is pleasantly surprising, since it’s not a course he had to take for political reasons.
Yeah… i kinda feel this is more bc of increasing pressure via political climate, givenhis record in the senate, which also seems to go under the radar.
I think even if he had gone more to the center, he wouldn’t have lost any significant portion of the progressive vote he did get, and I think this holds true this year as well. (And at that, a shift to the middle would likely have netted him more votes pulled from disillusioned non-MAGA moderate Republicans in 2020 than he lost far left Lemmy-user votes).
Having the name Donald Trump on the other side of the ballot is sufficiently powerful motivation for most reasonable progressives to “hold their nose and cast their ballot” for Biden. It might be a very different story if Biden were running against, say, a John Kasich or Larry Hogan, but that’s not what we’ve got. In that case, many on the left wing may see it more as a “both sides are the same so I’m voting third party to make a statement” election…but again, this isn’t that. In 2020 and now again in 2024, the choice is more accurately, “not making much ground on progressive causes” vs “regression on all fronts, combined with an attack on democracy, emboldening of fascists, racists, and militant bigots of all stripes”.
…and personally, if a progressive can look at that decision and think they’re basically the same thing…I see that as only slightly less disappointing than a loud and proud MAGA zombie.
There have always been dumbass leftists. I think this is the most vocal I’ve ever seen them though. And the most numerous. In previous elections we’ve been able to ignore them. Or at the very least, redirect them to doing something good, like punching Nazis.
Now they’re more likely to team up with the Nazis against rational people.
If people really followed Biden’s attempts to rein in Bibi, they would have a LOT more appreciation of his efforts too. Netanyahu is a madman yet Israel still needs protection.
It seems to me that it really strains credulity to suggest that the US has no further ability to reign in Natanyahu, especially if Isreal needs protection that badly. They basically depend on the US for their existence, but they also have the US over a barrel? How does that square up?
I think the problem is even for people who have followed it, he’s still funding his genocide. I think Biden had helped with the bombing pause and hostage release. But since then, his attempts to rein Bibi in have fallen flat and he’s given a blank check.
You make a good point about what if he stop supporting them and they are attacked. Israel is just as much a victim as Gaza. That would pretty quickly turn back around on Biden from a political perspective too.
Israel needs protection to continue its apartheid. If it ceased its illegal occupation of Gaza and the West Bank and allowed Palestinians to return to their homes per international law, it wouldn’t have nearly so many enemies.
Of course Netanyahu, his ministers, the IDF and many of the people of Israel are to blame. Biden is also enabling him by sending weapons. How can you ignore that?
It’s possible to support 3rd parties in the US. Just not for the 2024 presidential case. If you really want to support them, unfortunately you will have to do more than just appear at the ballot box.
If you want 3rd parties to be a viable option, you need to vote Democrats.
HOO. That would be like democrats voting for their own destruction. One of the only things Republicans and Democrats agree on is our current 2 party system, as it perpetuates them into eternity without any real competition and enable them to use wedge issues to get votes instead of doing actual work.
Ok doomer.
That’s entirely false. I provided sources showing, as I said, that Dems support RCV and GOP does not. Tell me: which party instituted RCV in North Carolina? And which party repealed it under the guise of “voter security”?
Getting real tired of choosing between bad and worse, and knowing full well if I don’t support bad I’ll get stuck with worse because of the duopoly.
Outside of Gaza, I think Biden has done a surprisingly good job. A lot of shit landed on his plate and he’s dealt with it better than most presidents would have.
And while he may not be as progressive as many progressives would like him to be, I feel he’s been more progressive than most ever expected him to be…which is pleasantly surprising, since it’s not a course he had to take for political reasons.
Yeah… i kinda feel this is more bc of increasing pressure via political climate, givenhis record in the senate, which also seems to go under the radar.
If he hadn’t he would have lost all support from people who actually voted for him. Minimal effort is effort I guess.
I completely disagree.
I think even if he had gone more to the center, he wouldn’t have lost any significant portion of the progressive vote he did get, and I think this holds true this year as well. (And at that, a shift to the middle would likely have netted him more votes pulled from disillusioned non-MAGA moderate Republicans in 2020 than he lost far left Lemmy-user votes).
Having the name Donald Trump on the other side of the ballot is sufficiently powerful motivation for most reasonable progressives to “hold their nose and cast their ballot” for Biden. It might be a very different story if Biden were running against, say, a John Kasich or Larry Hogan, but that’s not what we’ve got. In that case, many on the left wing may see it more as a “both sides are the same so I’m voting third party to make a statement” election…but again, this isn’t that. In 2020 and now again in 2024, the choice is more accurately, “not making much ground on progressive causes” vs “regression on all fronts, combined with an attack on democracy, emboldening of fascists, racists, and militant bigots of all stripes”.
…and personally, if a progressive can look at that decision and think they’re basically the same thing…I see that as only slightly less disappointing than a loud and proud MAGA zombie.
Seeing the sheer stupidity of the left wing is making me question democracy.
Seeing the sheer stupidity of most Lemmy users who proudly align themselves as leftists is making me question leftists in general.
There have always been dumbass leftists. I think this is the most vocal I’ve ever seen them though. And the most numerous. In previous elections we’ve been able to ignore them. Or at the very least, redirect them to doing something good, like punching Nazis.
Now they’re more likely to team up with the Nazis against rational people.
If people really followed Biden’s attempts to rein in Bibi, they would have a LOT more appreciation of his efforts too. Netanyahu is a madman yet Israel still needs protection.
It seems to me that it really strains credulity to suggest that the US has no further ability to reign in Natanyahu, especially if Isreal needs protection that badly. They basically depend on the US for their existence, but they also have the US over a barrel? How does that square up?
I think the problem is even for people who have followed it, he’s still funding his genocide. I think Biden had helped with the bombing pause and hostage release. But since then, his attempts to rein Bibi in have fallen flat and he’s given a blank check.
You make a good point about what if he stop supporting them and they are attacked. Israel is just as much a victim as Gaza. That would pretty quickly turn back around on Biden from a political perspective too.
Israel needs protection to continue its apartheid. If it ceased its illegal occupation of Gaza and the West Bank and allowed Palestinians to return to their homes per international law, it wouldn’t have nearly so many enemies.
I still think that counts as “less bad,” not “good,” considering pretty much all presidents are absolutely bad.
I agree with you, and I do believe he is working behind the scenes to mitigate the Palestinian genocide.
Unfortunately, outside of Gaza is like saying, outside of the Holocaust. It’s a huge issue.
If my vote counted, I’d vote for him, but I’m calling him genocide Joe for posterity.
So, you would have Biden bomb Israel? Get real, pin the blame on the cause, Bibi.
It’s awful hard to shoot someone without bullets
Of course Netanyahu, his ministers, the IDF and many of the people of Israel are to blame. Biden is also enabling him by sending weapons. How can you ignore that?
It’s possible to support 3rd parties in the US. Just not for the 2024 presidential case. If you really want to support them, unfortunately you will have to do more than just appear at the ballot box.
3rd parties in the US are impossible while we still have first past the post voting. One party has consistently been the one to support & pass RCV, while the other has consistently repealed & banned it. Guess which is which?
If you want 3rd parties to be a viable option, you need to vote Democrats. And more on the ground activism, I agree with you there
HOO. That would be like democrats voting for their own destruction. One of the only things Republicans and Democrats agree on is our current 2 party system, as it perpetuates them into eternity without any real competition and enable them to use wedge issues to get votes instead of doing actual work.
Ok doomer. That’s entirely false. I provided sources showing, as I said, that Dems support RCV and GOP does not. Tell me: which party instituted RCV in North Carolina? And which party repealed it under the guise of “voter security”?