‘What's striking isn't just that young adults are delaying milestones - it's that many are questioning whether those life events are achievable at all’ one financial expert said
I think it is more to try and have some amount of stability, rather than strictly how much you earn.
I used to live on £8k (part time apprenticeship), way below the poverty line apparently but I wasn’t really worrying about money either.
Suppose it depends what you view poor as being. Some seem to view it as always being on the edge of running out of money at the end of each month. If that is the case then I wasn’t poor despite only making £8k and I remember at the time hearing of people on over £25k who constantly were.
Even when I was on near minimum wage a couple years ago (£25k) I didn’t really know what to spend all my money on. Honestly? I still don’t. Picked up some hobbies but there is only so much you can spend gardening, a fork and spade don’t cost that much and plants turn into more plants for free. Allotment rent is like £50/year.
I agree, but at that point we’re really just saying you have a responsibility to be prepared to be especially frugal if you’re going to have kids while poor. I think that’s a subtle but important distinction. It is true, though.
It’s a hard conversation to have, because people bringing up wealth inequality certainly have a point, the data is there (at least for the US and where I am in Europe now), and I think there’s both a moral and practical argument for why that should be addressed. But again, lifestyle creep is real. For example, Americans are complaining about exorbitant housing prices… meanwhile the average American home size is something like twice most of Europe. Of course that’s going to be comparatively expensive. Part of that is the fault of construction companies, but that’s partially driven by demand.
Leasing cars and changing them out every few years is way too common, I knew plenty of people near minimum wage doing that. Like you said, food delivery is a big one. Instagrammable vacations is another.
There’s very much a “keeping up with the Jones’” culture that leads people who should by all rights be firmly middle class to feel like they’re much poorer than they really are. They get conflated with people who truly are poor, which is a much harder position to be in… the constant stress and anxiety of being poor, especially as an adult, leads to dopamine seeking from sources like cigarettes, alcohol, fast food… then there’s the issue of many working poor being “time poor”, encouraging that kind of delivery eating.
It’s a hard nut to crack because there are legitimate systemic, material issues driving some of it, and some simply “bad culture” around money and they’re pretty tangled up.
There are also different degrees of poor. Or at least below what most consider middle class to be. What is someone who is financially comfortable but clearly working class? People in stable but fairly low income jobs - basically me tbh.
My middle class friends view me as frugal. I say £24 for a pizza is crazy. Its flour and water with a topping of cheese and tomato. Yes, a plain margarita being sold for £24. Oh its “artisan sourdough” - fuck off, that is just some dough you left in the back of a cupboard for a week. I make my own sourdough because its cheaper than buying yeast.
I think it is more to try and have some amount of stability, rather than strictly how much you earn.
I used to live on £8k (part time apprenticeship), way below the poverty line apparently but I wasn’t really worrying about money either.
Suppose it depends what you view poor as being. Some seem to view it as always being on the edge of running out of money at the end of each month. If that is the case then I wasn’t poor despite only making £8k and I remember at the time hearing of people on over £25k who constantly were.
Even when I was on near minimum wage a couple years ago (£25k) I didn’t really know what to spend all my money on. Honestly? I still don’t. Picked up some hobbies but there is only so much you can spend gardening, a fork and spade don’t cost that much and plants turn into more plants for free. Allotment rent is like £50/year.
I agree, but at that point we’re really just saying you have a responsibility to be prepared to be especially frugal if you’re going to have kids while poor. I think that’s a subtle but important distinction. It is true, though.
It’s a hard conversation to have, because people bringing up wealth inequality certainly have a point, the data is there (at least for the US and where I am in Europe now), and I think there’s both a moral and practical argument for why that should be addressed. But again, lifestyle creep is real. For example, Americans are complaining about exorbitant housing prices… meanwhile the average American home size is something like twice most of Europe. Of course that’s going to be comparatively expensive. Part of that is the fault of construction companies, but that’s partially driven by demand.
Leasing cars and changing them out every few years is way too common, I knew plenty of people near minimum wage doing that. Like you said, food delivery is a big one. Instagrammable vacations is another.
There’s very much a “keeping up with the Jones’” culture that leads people who should by all rights be firmly middle class to feel like they’re much poorer than they really are. They get conflated with people who truly are poor, which is a much harder position to be in… the constant stress and anxiety of being poor, especially as an adult, leads to dopamine seeking from sources like cigarettes, alcohol, fast food… then there’s the issue of many working poor being “time poor”, encouraging that kind of delivery eating.
It’s a hard nut to crack because there are legitimate systemic, material issues driving some of it, and some simply “bad culture” around money and they’re pretty tangled up.
There are also different degrees of poor. Or at least below what most consider middle class to be. What is someone who is financially comfortable but clearly working class? People in stable but fairly low income jobs - basically me tbh.
My middle class friends view me as frugal. I say £24 for a pizza is crazy. Its flour and water with a topping of cheese and tomato. Yes, a plain margarita being sold for £24. Oh its “artisan sourdough” - fuck off, that is just some dough you left in the back of a cupboard for a week. I make my own sourdough because its cheaper than buying yeast.