Yeah because the voters who voted against Trump ALL THREE TIMES are just as much to blame as those who voted for him. /s
ETA: I’m not the person asking for Canada to liberate America. And I’m also not excusing Trump’s behavior (and how the fuck anyone can read it that way is beyond me!). My point is that not all Americans are the same (which should be fucking obvious to anyone with two braincells to rub together), and it’s lazy and stupid to frame it that way. Many of us know this is a very fucked-up situation for everyone, and are trying to figure out pragmatic ways out of this clusterfuck.
If Americans want Trump for President it is not up to other countries to decide otherwise for USA. USA must decide for themselves.
That’s a fundamental principle of democracy, and it is also a fundamental right for a country according to international law.
What administration and government USA has is up to the Americans. Only Americans think it is also up to the Americans to decide the government for other countries. So for instance they overturned the democratically elected government in Iran in 1953, and instated the Shah as sovereign ruler. Later of course resulting in rebellion, where the 2 major sides were the Communist and Religious, which ended with the religious ruling system Iran has today.
USA is with their interference the root cause for a lot of the problems we have in Iran today, and USA still treat Iran as if they were the ones creating the problems.
You are basically asking USA allies to do the same to USA! 🤡
Don’t ask Canada for help, convince the stupid MAGA idiot to stop being an idiot.
A conservative cannot change. It can only stop existing. Every time I call for that change to happen on social media like lemmy, the post gets removed.
We desperately need to finish the civil war. As long as conservatives exist, the evil version of the US exists. We can solve that, but not without the ability to fucking at least communicate and organize. Where can I go to be involved in organized vi----t resistance?
Corporations and even independent platforms like Lemmy forbid such discussion. But there is absolutely no peaceful solution to conservatism/fascism. We’re stuck. Should we take direct violent action against neighbors at this point? The results would not be enough without organizing.
Everyone demands action, but no one seems to have a good answer on how to communicate about what actually needs to be done. We need a platform we can actually communicate on without comments being removed for “promoting violence”.
You don’t generally set out from the beginning stating you intend to use violence.
A rebellion has to start by peaceful means, and the other side give in to overwhelming numbers.
I don’t think the left in USA have overwhelming numbers. So the best way for now seems to me to be to work to influence the democracy away from the extreme right that has become normalized.
I agree we should not start with violence. And we didn’t start with violence. Our peaceful protests have been met with violence and 50 year prison sentences for non-violent protest. The time for non-violent methods has passed. There is no peaceful solution any more.
But we need to be able to communicate to organize the next steps. Those of us ready and willing to engage in those next steps don’t have any platform or place for that as far as I can tell. Where do we sign up to fight? Where do we go to train with others? Where do we go to even communicate plans without our comments being removed?
I don’t think they were really serious about wanting an actual invasion. Obviously any military action between Canada and the US would end up with terrible short term outcomes for the average person in either country. I’m pretty sure it was just gallows humor because anyone with two braincells to rub together can see that the US is currently a shit show, getting worse every day and may not recover in our lifetimes, if ever.
If we really want to get things cleaned up ASAP, we would need a general strike. But I’m not holding my breath since that is incredibly painful and risky for people who live paycheck to paycheck, have almost no worker protections and depend on employer sponsored health insurance to get any care from our batshit crazy exploitative healthcare system. So we will pin our hopes on the weak sauce opposition party getting legislative power in January, assuming that all the blatant cheating and voter supression don’t completely fuck us.
IDK, your reaponse feels like yelling at an abused spouse for fantasizing about a hero coming in and beating up their abuser. “Assaulting your spouse won’t solve anything!!!” Yeah? No shit? Really?
If you want to be helpful (and you should since a nucelar state going full Nazi next door is not in your best interest) keep your feet on our throats. I’ve seen US liquor sales down 20-60% in Canada, that should be 100%. No one should be buying anything from us or using any of our services while regime is threatening your and other soverign nations. Hopefully your people are pressuring their representatives to take as hard a line as feasible with this administration.
Indeed, and that’s a very strong stranglehold on American workers that seriously needs to be changed. I never understood the logic of that arrangement, until I realized it helped maintain the power balance status quo.
If you want to be helpful
I do and I did by explaining the reality of the situation, the problems won’t be solved by looking for solutions in all the wrong places.
The responsibility is with the Americans and no one else.
No, I’m pointing out that there are tens of millions of Americans who did not vote for this catastrophe, and who have very limited abilities to change the system. So acting like we’re all equally culpable is stupid.
And I’m not the one who asked Canada for help. That was someone else you 🤡.
I think the other commenters on this topic often assume that you know that merely voting is not full civic participation, nor adoption of the full responsibility of maintaining democracy.
Keeping the tyrants down is a lot of work, and always has been… and most people have also always been ’poor’. Ancient Greek democracy only lasted a few hundred years, I bet part of that was people gave up doing all the civic duties and left it to the powermongers.
And how the fuck are those who have constantly spoken out against this administration, gone to protests, boycotted companies that support it, and voted consistently against it supposed to take ‘accountability’?
And don’t give me any of that radical fantasy world bullshit proposing we try to assassinate him or other idiocy.
You know what, don’t bother answering. Because I know it’ll be some fucking nonsense.
It’s easy to wag your finger at all Americans from the fucking sidelines and brand us as being all the same. But in reality it’s much more complicated than a blanket “AmErIcAnS bAD!!1!” sentiment.
Taking accountability looks like not inventing ways to be personally offended about people pointing out who Americans democratically elected to their leadership, and honestly acknowledging what many Americans actually want.
How about you shut the fuck up about being some special non-American American and realize that literally nobody blamed you personally and yet you are going out of your way to act personally offended that Americans are being asked to take accountability for democratically electing their President.
Put all this energy you have into getting mad at random people online for saying things that aren’t even about you into leaving the country for good if you actually hate being identified as an American so much.
You may not be the exactly same as all the MAGA types but you’re not too far off with them with how unhinged and angry you are.
Look up certain failed painter time. No none gave a damn some Germans didn’t like him and that he took over by proclaiming insurgency, not even being democratically voted. All Germany was blamed, divided and forced to compensate. Especially US didn’t care. Why would you expect other country folks to feel differently about US.
Yeah because the voters who voted against Trump ALL THREE TIMES are just as much to blame as those who voted for him. /s
ETA: I’m not the person asking for Canada to liberate America. And I’m also not excusing Trump’s behavior (and how the fuck anyone can read it that way is beyond me!). My point is that not all Americans are the same (which should be fucking obvious to anyone with two braincells to rub together), and it’s lazy and stupid to frame it that way. Many of us know this is a very fucked-up situation for everyone, and are trying to figure out pragmatic ways out of this clusterfuck.
It’s probably more about the people who didn’t vote
If Americans want Trump for President it is not up to other countries to decide otherwise for USA. USA must decide for themselves.
That’s a fundamental principle of democracy, and it is also a fundamental right for a country according to international law.
What administration and government USA has is up to the Americans. Only Americans think it is also up to the Americans to decide the government for other countries. So for instance they overturned the democratically elected government in Iran in 1953, and instated the Shah as sovereign ruler. Later of course resulting in rebellion, where the 2 major sides were the Communist and Religious, which ended with the religious ruling system Iran has today.
USA is with their interference the root cause for a lot of the problems we have in Iran today, and USA still treat Iran as if they were the ones creating the problems.
You are basically asking USA allies to do the same to USA! 🤡
Don’t ask Canada for help, convince the stupid MAGA idiot to stop being an idiot.
A conservative cannot change. It can only stop existing. Every time I call for that change to happen on social media like lemmy, the post gets removed.
We desperately need to finish the civil war. As long as conservatives exist, the evil version of the US exists. We can solve that, but not without the ability to fucking at least communicate and organize. Where can I go to be involved in organized vi----t resistance?
Corporations and even independent platforms like Lemmy forbid such discussion. But there is absolutely no peaceful solution to conservatism/fascism. We’re stuck. Should we take direct violent action against neighbors at this point? The results would not be enough without organizing.
Everyone demands action, but no one seems to have a good answer on how to communicate about what actually needs to be done. We need a platform we can actually communicate on without comments being removed for “promoting violence”.
You don’t generally set out from the beginning stating you intend to use violence.
A rebellion has to start by peaceful means, and the other side give in to overwhelming numbers.
I don’t think the left in USA have overwhelming numbers. So the best way for now seems to me to be to work to influence the democracy away from the extreme right that has become normalized.
I agree we should not start with violence. And we didn’t start with violence. Our peaceful protests have been met with violence and 50 year prison sentences for non-violent protest. The time for non-violent methods has passed. There is no peaceful solution any more.
But we need to be able to communicate to organize the next steps. Those of us ready and willing to engage in those next steps don’t have any platform or place for that as far as I can tell. Where do we sign up to fight? Where do we go to train with others? Where do we go to even communicate plans without our comments being removed?
I don’t think they were really serious about wanting an actual invasion. Obviously any military action between Canada and the US would end up with terrible short term outcomes for the average person in either country. I’m pretty sure it was just gallows humor because anyone with two braincells to rub together can see that the US is currently a shit show, getting worse every day and may not recover in our lifetimes, if ever.
If we really want to get things cleaned up ASAP, we would need a general strike. But I’m not holding my breath since that is incredibly painful and risky for people who live paycheck to paycheck, have almost no worker protections and depend on employer sponsored health insurance to get any care from our batshit crazy exploitative healthcare system. So we will pin our hopes on the weak sauce opposition party getting legislative power in January, assuming that all the blatant cheating and voter supression don’t completely fuck us.
IDK, your reaponse feels like yelling at an abused spouse for fantasizing about a hero coming in and beating up their abuser. “Assaulting your spouse won’t solve anything!!!” Yeah? No shit? Really?
If you want to be helpful (and you should since a nucelar state going full Nazi next door is not in your best interest) keep your feet on our throats. I’ve seen US liquor sales down 20-60% in Canada, that should be 100%. No one should be buying anything from us or using any of our services while regime is threatening your and other soverign nations. Hopefully your people are pressuring their representatives to take as hard a line as feasible with this administration.
Indeed, and that’s a very strong stranglehold on American workers that seriously needs to be changed. I never understood the logic of that arrangement, until I realized it helped maintain the power balance status quo.
I do and I did by explaining the reality of the situation, the problems won’t be solved by looking for solutions in all the wrong places.
The responsibility is with the Americans and no one else.
Are you honestly explaining to an American that it is not up to another country to impose a change in government on another country?
I would argue that the concept of imposed regime change is deeply ingrained in their minds.
Yes it’s almost like they think it’s a natural and normal thing to do?!
They honestly don’t even need to convince maga, just get people to actually bother showing up to vote.
No, I’m pointing out that there are tens of millions of Americans who did not vote for this catastrophe, and who have very limited abilities to change the system. So acting like we’re all equally culpable is stupid.
And I’m not the one who asked Canada for help. That was someone else you 🤡.
I think the other commenters on this topic often assume that you know that merely voting is not full civic participation, nor adoption of the full responsibility of maintaining democracy.
Keeping the tyrants down is a lot of work, and always has been… and most people have also always been ’poor’. Ancient Greek democracy only lasted a few hundred years, I bet part of that was people gave up doing all the civic duties and left it to the powermongers.
That’s a fair point.
Yes because nobody would know that otherwise. /s 😱
I know, but you defended the viewpoint, and argued against the response that correctly states that Americans need to liberate themselves.
Half the population didn’t vote for him.
A significant proportion of the people who did vote for him regret their decision.
You are in the majority.
Nothing happens.
89 million eligible people didn’t vote, more than either candidate got votes. If you start from that, only 32% voted for Trump.
This is literally the opposite of taking accountability.
And how the fuck are those who have constantly spoken out against this administration, gone to protests, boycotted companies that support it, and voted consistently against it supposed to take ‘accountability’?
And don’t give me any of that radical fantasy world bullshit proposing we try to assassinate him or other idiocy.
You know what, don’t bother answering. Because I know it’ll be some fucking nonsense.
It’s easy to wag your finger at all Americans from the fucking sidelines and brand us as being all the same. But in reality it’s much more complicated than a blanket “AmErIcAnS bAD!!1!” sentiment.
Taking accountability looks like not inventing ways to be personally offended about people pointing out who Americans democratically elected to their leadership, and honestly acknowledging what many Americans actually want.
How about you shut the fuck up about being some special non-American American and realize that literally nobody blamed you personally and yet you are going out of your way to act personally offended that Americans are being asked to take accountability for democratically electing their President.
Put all this energy you have into getting mad at random people online for saying things that aren’t even about you into leaving the country for good if you actually hate being identified as an American so much.
You may not be the exactly same as all the MAGA types but you’re not too far off with them with how unhinged and angry you are.
Look up certain failed painter time. No none gave a damn some Germans didn’t like him and that he took over by proclaiming insurgency, not even being democratically voted. All Germany was blamed, divided and forced to compensate. Especially US didn’t care. Why would you expect other country folks to feel differently about US.
Accountability and blame aren’t the same thing. Learn the difference.