“Just be productive”-level take here. For clarification, because I see you telling others that you “are intelligent”: that is a really dumb take to have.
yup, getting some real "have you tried not being sick?‘’ energy there. people assume just because they can do something and it’s logical for them, it works the same way for everyone,
well except for the ‘lazy’ part, that doesn’t work the same way (according to them)
shit, even trying to explain it doesn’t make sense
Not in the moment, but overall, if someone is spending 3hrs in the day on their phone (and not enjoying it) they should absolutely install use reduction tools, or have a family member hold on to the device during the workday/non chill-out time.
Illness is real but harm reduction is possible. Cellphones are known attention traps due to the neverending click-scroll dopamine loop
Yes, harm reduction is possible, but it requires motivation to do so, I believe is one side of the argument presented in the comments around here.
The phone is maybe a bad example as something that can be removed in one swoop.
Picture a student (with no phone, they use their desktop computer in 2007) having an exam in 7 days and carefully planning on the first day - I’ll have to get through 350 pages before this exam. 50 pages a day is more than easy mode. Then they start on the first batch and suddenly get the urge to clean their room. Once that’s almost done, they start wondering if penguins actually have knees or not, so they go online and check. Then they see the book lying on the bed, 6 pages / 50 done. Get back to the book but realize they stopped in the middle of a long paragraph, time to go back to pages to remember what was said. 10 more pages. Maybe they should have some coffee. They suddenly have the urge to find out in detail how coffee is roasted. At this point some 4 hours have passed, the room still isn’t fully clean, nobody knows for sure if penguins have knees and there’s a bag of open coffee grounds lying somewhere in the dorm room. Where the hell was it? And they needed to pee for like 30 minutes now but how is coffee roasted?
Exam is coming and this shit has been going on for 3 days. The dread now sets in, with the needed amount of work doubled. Must avoid the dread. Brain goes back to old tricks and pulls a quick one to distract from dread.
2 days left - brain goes into oh shit mode. Dread-distract-repeat. All nighter time. Somehow it works.
I do agree with you that phones are attention-traps and would say that they make make it easier to mask this sort of behaviour by just staring at a screen, because the sheer amount of stuff you can do on your phone from browsing pictures of cats to finding actually interesting content (video or otherwise) to ordering food or cleaning supplies or chatting with friends means it’s now easier than ever to get distracted while appearing outwardly otherwise unoccupied, but the brain is firing in random directions like a dog chasing s fleet of scared squirrels.
All this to say that yes, you can throw the phone away, but never underestimate the ability of a distraction-prone mind to keep itself distracted.
Yep. One of the meds I tried for depression killed my ability to feel 99% of emotions. I would literally stay in bed until I HAD to use the bathroom, and then go right back to laying down, doing absolutely nothing the whole day. I was told by a ridiculous number of people that I just had to push myself for the meds to help. Like I was eating one meal a day because I had to in order to take my meds. Living on 600 calories a day sucks, but I just didn’t care. You can’t make yourself care when have no energy.
No, not at all. “Just be bored” is my message. The effect of lying on the couch with a phone is that you’re low key entertained for the whole time. That’s highly damaging.
I think that’s a misunderstanding of how ADHD, and in fact mental illness in general, works. Perhaps for some people removing the distraction will work, but more often in my experience another will just fit in its place. The phone is not the problem, it is a symptom.
And part of harm reduction is removing symptoms. Say, if you have a bad headache, you might not cure whatever is causing it by taking pain meds, but at least you’ll function.
I’m aware how ADHD behaves, I have it. I’ve been medicated for years.
It is obvious to me and many others who have it that things of great dopamine satisfaction are ESPECIALLY distracting. Cellphone distraction is a known attention sink and such things are even more powerful for folks with attention/focus issues.
I guarantee any of us locked in a blank room and a sink full of dishes would be faster to complete the chore if we were without engrossing distraction.
Those with ADHD have an even higher responsibility to themselves to remove distractions and keep a “clean” lifestyle. It’s a cop out to not acknowledge massive distraction triggers or traps.
I’m not suggesting those struggling are lesser. Only that they may be not meeting their own self care needs, willfully or otherwise.
If you’re aware of how adhd works then you of all people should know that “throw your phone in the toilet” is shite advice that only someone who doesn’t know how adhd works would give. If you have adhd then you should know better than that.
I agree on phone usage restriction apps. You can also extend the usage as a reward for achieving things which would work as an external motivation that ADHD people need. I also agree with other people that it won’t even be close to solving ADHD problems, people were just arguing with you about different thing because they thought that you have the same perception of ADHD as the top level comment.
People are incredibly fast to claim that somebody doesn’t understand how ADHD or procrastination works, just because they said something they don’t quite agree with.
“throw your phone in the toilet” is not and has never been the solution to this problem in any universe under the sun, so no, it’s not just because they said something I don’t like. They’re just backpedalling.
A lot of people seem to wear disorders like add/ADHD like an identity. At least online…
Like, I’m not a lesser person for my disorder, but I HAVE a disorder. It’s my responsibility to myself to maximize my outcomes, and minimize the impacts.
Being critical of what distracts me, or triggers a tangential behavior track is so important to my being successful. In the case of cell phones, that is a known trap for even non ADHD folks, so my sharing it as relevant here isn’t some wacko suggestion hah
you don’t get it. imagine trying to convince yourself to eat a pile of shit. even without your phone you would procrastinate it to the beat of your ability.
Unfortunately, it’s not the phone that’s the issue. Blocking apps or putting my phone in focus mode only works temporarily, and I’ll quickly find some other new way to procrastinate. Take away my phone, TV, books, and everything else, and I’ll just suddenly need to do some pointless chores instead.
ADHD is a mental health condition. A disability. Would you tell a paraplegic in a wheelchair to just be healthy and stand? Have you heard the term “invisible disability?” Many mental health issues are invisible. You know the dude muttering to himself on the street needs help, if not some grace about their abilities. But the dude with ADHD trying to do a simple task but his brain is wired differently making it as hard as a paraplegic getting up and standing… you don’t know to give him grace. How would you? That’s why these posts are important. Maybe people can understand what it’s like. Especially this post. It’s literally describing the difference in perception between individuals.
The mind is way more malleable than the body, so I think the analogy isn’t perfect. But let’s run with it. Let’s take someone who has had a serious injury, but is not completely paralyzed and can be healed through rehabilitation. Telling them to not just sit in the wheelchair would be analogous to telling an ADHD person to stop lying in the couch with the phone for 3 consecutive hours.
You “take it seriously” by telling people who are struggling to destroy an expensive item? Do you want people to throw themselves in the toilet if they are doing nothing and can’t manage to move?
Dude, they have ADHD, not low intelligence. They can understand that the metaphor can include less drastic actions like “give it to someone else” or “sell it”.
Huh?? Where did you get that I said ADHD means low intelligence? Oh right, nowhere cause I didn’t say it. And how is saying someone should throw their phone in the toilet a metaphor?
This seems like it’s not a joke, so I’ll choose to take it seriously.
Throw your fucking phone in the toilet if you spend 3 hours with it trying to “convince yourself” to do something.
“Just be productive”-level take here. For clarification, because I see you telling others that you “are intelligent”: that is a really dumb take to have.
yup, getting some real "have you tried not being sick?‘’ energy there. people assume just because they can do something and it’s logical for them, it works the same way for everyone,
well except for the ‘lazy’ part, that doesn’t work the same way (according to them)
shit, even trying to explain it doesn’t make sense
Not in the moment, but overall, if someone is spending 3hrs in the day on their phone (and not enjoying it) they should absolutely install use reduction tools, or have a family member hold on to the device during the workday/non chill-out time.
Illness is real but harm reduction is possible. Cellphones are known attention traps due to the neverending click-scroll dopamine loop
Yes, harm reduction is possible, but it requires motivation to do so, I believe is one side of the argument presented in the comments around here.
The phone is maybe a bad example as something that can be removed in one swoop.
Picture a student (with no phone, they use their desktop computer in 2007) having an exam in 7 days and carefully planning on the first day - I’ll have to get through 350 pages before this exam. 50 pages a day is more than easy mode. Then they start on the first batch and suddenly get the urge to clean their room. Once that’s almost done, they start wondering if penguins actually have knees or not, so they go online and check. Then they see the book lying on the bed, 6 pages / 50 done. Get back to the book but realize they stopped in the middle of a long paragraph, time to go back to pages to remember what was said. 10 more pages. Maybe they should have some coffee. They suddenly have the urge to find out in detail how coffee is roasted. At this point some 4 hours have passed, the room still isn’t fully clean, nobody knows for sure if penguins have knees and there’s a bag of open coffee grounds lying somewhere in the dorm room. Where the hell was it? And they needed to pee for like 30 minutes now but how is coffee roasted?
Exam is coming and this shit has been going on for 3 days. The dread now sets in, with the needed amount of work doubled. Must avoid the dread. Brain goes back to old tricks and pulls a quick one to distract from dread.
2 days left - brain goes into oh shit mode. Dread-distract-repeat. All nighter time. Somehow it works.
I do agree with you that phones are attention-traps and would say that they make make it easier to mask this sort of behaviour by just staring at a screen, because the sheer amount of stuff you can do on your phone from browsing pictures of cats to finding actually interesting content (video or otherwise) to ordering food or cleaning supplies or chatting with friends means it’s now easier than ever to get distracted while appearing outwardly otherwise unoccupied, but the brain is firing in random directions like a dog chasing s fleet of scared squirrels.
All this to say that yes, you can throw the phone away, but never underestimate the ability of a distraction-prone mind to keep itself distracted.
Yep. One of the meds I tried for depression killed my ability to feel 99% of emotions. I would literally stay in bed until I HAD to use the bathroom, and then go right back to laying down, doing absolutely nothing the whole day. I was told by a ridiculous number of people that I just had to push myself for the meds to help. Like I was eating one meal a day because I had to in order to take my meds. Living on 600 calories a day sucks, but I just didn’t care. You can’t make yourself care when have no energy.
No, not at all. If your analogy is sickness, I would say “have you tried not eating feces all the time?”
No, not at all. “Just be bored” is my message. The effect of lying on the couch with a phone is that you’re low key entertained for the whole time. That’s highly damaging.
I think that’s a misunderstanding of how ADHD, and in fact mental illness in general, works. Perhaps for some people removing the distraction will work, but more often in my experience another will just fit in its place. The phone is not the problem, it is a symptom.
And part of harm reduction is removing symptoms. Say, if you have a bad headache, you might not cure whatever is causing it by taking pain meds, but at least you’ll function.
Phones are a very powerful attention trap. I’d be curious to hear an argument of a more powerful and accessable one
Literally fucking anything that seems more pleasant than thing I’m procrastinating
The phone isn’t what causes this issue in people with adhd, I do it with or without a phone. You’re just misunderstanding how adhd works.
I’m aware how ADHD behaves, I have it. I’ve been medicated for years.
It is obvious to me and many others who have it that things of great dopamine satisfaction are ESPECIALLY distracting. Cellphone distraction is a known attention sink and such things are even more powerful for folks with attention/focus issues.
I guarantee any of us locked in a blank room and a sink full of dishes would be faster to complete the chore if we were without engrossing distraction.
Those with ADHD have an even higher responsibility to themselves to remove distractions and keep a “clean” lifestyle. It’s a cop out to not acknowledge massive distraction triggers or traps.
I’m not suggesting those struggling are lesser. Only that they may be not meeting their own self care needs, willfully or otherwise.
If you’re aware of how adhd works then you of all people should know that “throw your phone in the toilet” is shite advice that only someone who doesn’t know how adhd works would give. If you have adhd then you should know better than that.
Well my doctor advised me to limit intense distractions to allow me to focus on my wellness and accomplish tasks. I never said throw the phone away.
It took a lot of work to limit and change my habits, and help from my wife to help me block out stimuli and keep it away.
Executive function is fucking hard enough without bullshit attention sinks.
I agree on phone usage restriction apps. You can also extend the usage as a reward for achieving things which would work as an external motivation that ADHD people need. I also agree with other people that it won’t even be close to solving ADHD problems, people were just arguing with you about different thing because they thought that you have the same perception of ADHD as the top level comment.
People are incredibly fast to claim that somebody doesn’t understand how ADHD or procrastination works, just because they said something they don’t quite agree with.
“throw your phone in the toilet” is not and has never been the solution to this problem in any universe under the sun, so no, it’s not just because they said something I don’t like. They’re just backpedalling.
A lot of people seem to wear disorders like add/ADHD like an identity. At least online…
Like, I’m not a lesser person for my disorder, but I HAVE a disorder. It’s my responsibility to myself to maximize my outcomes, and minimize the impacts.
Being critical of what distracts me, or triggers a tangential behavior track is so important to my being successful. In the case of cell phones, that is a known trap for even non ADHD folks, so my sharing it as relevant here isn’t some wacko suggestion hah
When there perfect fixes aren’t available (which is almost always), partial fixes are golden.
Man just read the meme again. The whole point is it looks like an attention trap but in ADHD it’s just a facade.
you don’t get it. imagine trying to convince yourself to eat a pile of shit. even without your phone you would procrastinate it to the beat of your ability.
Oh you misunderstand, the same thing happens without a phone. It just turns into laying on the couch not looking at a phone for 3 hours
I misunderstand nothing. Laying on the couch for 3 hours without a phone (etc) is way better.
Unfortunately, it’s not the phone that’s the issue. Blocking apps or putting my phone in focus mode only works temporarily, and I’ll quickly find some other new way to procrastinate. Take away my phone, TV, books, and everything else, and I’ll just suddenly need to do some pointless chores instead.
ADHD is a mental health condition. A disability. Would you tell a paraplegic in a wheelchair to just be healthy and stand? Have you heard the term “invisible disability?” Many mental health issues are invisible. You know the dude muttering to himself on the street needs help, if not some grace about their abilities. But the dude with ADHD trying to do a simple task but his brain is wired differently making it as hard as a paraplegic getting up and standing… you don’t know to give him grace. How would you? That’s why these posts are important. Maybe people can understand what it’s like. Especially this post. It’s literally describing the difference in perception between individuals.
Does that make sense?
The mind is way more malleable than the body, so I think the analogy isn’t perfect. But let’s run with it. Let’s take someone who has had a serious injury, but is not completely paralyzed and can be healed through rehabilitation. Telling them to not just sit in the wheelchair would be analogous to telling an ADHD person to stop lying in the couch with the phone for 3 consecutive hours.
Do you understand it now?
narrator He did not.
Do you want to learn or win? Bc I don’t need to debate you. You’re objectively wrong per science and facts. Your opinions don’t mean anything.
They just wanna argue it seems. I apparently put words in their mouth by asking a question.
Yeah, I tried. Fuck that loser.
Same. I’ll try to educate, but I’d have better luck trying to teach a brick to tap dance with some people.
Were in lying in the sofa when you wrote this?
You’re an annoying Cunt, and the type of person that drives people from Lemmy. You’re very unlikable. Do people tolerate you IRL?
You “take it seriously” by telling people who are struggling to destroy an expensive item? Do you want people to throw themselves in the toilet if they are doing nothing and can’t manage to move?
Dude, they have ADHD, not low intelligence. They can understand that the metaphor can include less drastic actions like “give it to someone else” or “sell it”.
Huh?? Where did you get that I said ADHD means low intelligence? Oh right, nowhere cause I didn’t say it. And how is saying someone should throw their phone in the toilet a metaphor?
As if you didn’t put words into my mouth :)
I put words in your mouth by asking you a question? That’s not how that works, nice try.