Counterpoint: the rich want to get richer, and the lapdogs want their bribes, and the lazy folks in the middle can only be motivated by fear (not even greed works anymore, e.g. for retirees who already got theirs), so to break out of this cycle would take… … …
I’m starting to wonder if we could even break this cycle. Nobody seems to give a shit, and if they do, whatever they’re doing seems to not be working.
For fuck’s sake, a surprisingly large amount of Americans want an insurrectionist, fascist, Russian-loving “president”that has openly said he will be dictator (but “only” for a day!). It would be one thing if it were a vocal minority just being really loud, but the fact that there’s an actual large amount of people who want a person like that makes me wonder if the US citizenry is broken.
In the wild, it is rare to see a predator before it strikes. Have you ever seen one of those games where there is a picture and you are supposed to find it… but you can’t, even zooming in and scanning every section, and then even when the answer is shown you can barely make it out? In the wild, prey aren’t supposed to evade death - the entire food chain is predicated on that fact. Ofc the predator still has to cross the distance between it and the prey, but lulling it into a sense of complacency is the first part of its successful strategy, then it waits for the prey to turn its head, and only THEN does it pounce. Sorry if this is upsetting but it’s very relevant I promise you, and in no way shippable for this conversation.
So in the wild, if I ever were to see this large fat orange buffoon, bumbling around while making wild hooting noises, actively trying to get noticed by saying whatever manages to get the most reaction from everyone around, I think I would be wisest to run away. Crucially though, not from the orange thing - which has no obvious teeth or claws or anything at all harmful - but from whatever it is that may be following it (whether the orange thing has any knowledge of that or not), waiting to take advantage of the distraction that it provides.
Whether any particular person wins the next election or not, there are always more willing to step up in their place - more Republicans, more Democrats, etc. - and a smart predator is ready to take advantage of whichever side wins in order to get what they want.
Sorry if you thought I was building up to some point worth knowing about - I have found no solutions, only more layers of problems the further deep you dig into these matters.:-( I will say that often when you meet Trump supporters irl, they can be very kind people - they are mislead, but aren’t we all? It is the system that is broken, not solely them (obviously outliers exist, on both sides, and no they are not remotely close to being equal <cough>KKK<cough>, but nor is the problem uniquely on one side vs. the other either, plus the whole division between “sides” is working out VERY well to Putin’s benefit, hence making me question just how much involvement his agencies have with the recent Civil War style divisionist thinking that is currently fashionable).
I think all we can do is question what we see, and compare it against what we KNOW to be true. Which not everyone is capable of - e.g. who has the luxury of that kind of time? A great place to start, imho, is to recommend watching https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rStL7niR7gs.
Well voting for the Capitalist party ain’t it. So start by NOT voting for the Capitalist parties, and then seeing what else you can do outside of the voting booth. But if you refuse NOT to vote for the Capitalist party, then do you really have a problem with the current system since you are actively supporting it.
I don’t follow you. They are BOTH the capitalist party, though not equally so. Also, voting for one side vs. the other does not mean that you agree with EVERYTHING that they do - in fact it is more common these days to vote against the other side and ignore what your own might plan or actually do. Nor is it true that avoiding voting - e.g. for mental or physical health reasons - means that someone does not care at all about what happens as a result of the election. Plus, a rather ENORMOUS fraction of people in the USA could skip a particular vote and it would not make the tiniest iota of difference, due to the electoral college system, though that heavily depends on where you live, and also trends to be more true the larger the region impacted (federal > state > county), whereas local elections could turn on a dime and also make a huge impact regardless of what goes on in upper levels - e.g. federal sends monies to help people but locals turn that aid away b/c “reasons”.
Unpopular opinion alert: I dare to say that many people who should NOT be voting - especially those who do little to no research beforehand - would vastly improve the outcome of elections by NOT voting, and thereby contribute more that way than they do now, by actually voting, where they tend to just magnify the votes of whatever the TV & radio talk show people (or more recently, pastors behind the pulpit) tell them to do. The latter makes the USA even more of a plutocracy than later, when the votes get ignored and the rich get whatever they want regardless of who got elected does.
You are missing the big picture. Capital benefits by people voting for either party of Capital. It doesn’t matter which one you vote for, important things like material conditions for real people will never improve if you vote like you are advocating. If you can’t even vote against Capital, then what good are you?
Counterpoint: the rich want to get richer, and the lapdogs want their bribes, and the lazy folks in the middle can only be motivated by fear (not even greed works anymore, e.g. for retirees who already got theirs), so to break out of this cycle would take… … …
I have no clue.
I’m starting to wonder if we could even break this cycle. Nobody seems to give a shit, and if they do, whatever they’re doing seems to not be working.
For fuck’s sake, a surprisingly large amount of Americans want an insurrectionist, fascist, Russian-loving “president” that has openly said he will be dictator (but “only” for a day!). It would be one thing if it were a vocal minority just being really loud, but the fact that there’s an actual large amount of people who want a person like that makes me wonder if the US citizenry is broken.
In the wild, it is rare to see a predator before it strikes. Have you ever seen one of those games where there is a picture and you are supposed to find it… but you can’t, even zooming in and scanning every section, and then even when the answer is shown you can barely make it out? In the wild, prey aren’t supposed to evade death - the entire food chain is predicated on that fact. Ofc the predator still has to cross the distance between it and the prey, but lulling it into a sense of complacency is the first part of its successful strategy, then it waits for the prey to turn its head, and only THEN does it pounce. Sorry if this is upsetting but it’s very relevant I promise you, and in no way shippable for this conversation.
So in the wild, if I ever were to see this large fat orange buffoon, bumbling around while making wild hooting noises, actively trying to get noticed by saying whatever manages to get the most reaction from everyone around, I think I would be wisest to run away. Crucially though, not from the orange thing - which has no obvious teeth or claws or anything at all harmful - but from whatever it is that may be following it (whether the orange thing has any knowledge of that or not), waiting to take advantage of the distraction that it provides.
Whether any particular person wins the next election or not, there are always more willing to step up in their place - more Republicans, more Democrats, etc. - and a smart predator is ready to take advantage of whichever side wins in order to get what they want.
Sorry if you thought I was building up to some point worth knowing about - I have found no solutions, only more layers of problems the further deep you dig into these matters.:-( I will say that often when you meet Trump supporters irl, they can be very kind people - they are mislead, but aren’t we all? It is the system that is broken, not solely them (obviously outliers exist, on both sides, and no they are not remotely close to being equal <cough>KKK<cough>, but nor is the problem uniquely on one side vs. the other either, plus the whole division between “sides” is working out VERY well to Putin’s benefit, hence making me question just how much involvement his agencies have with the recent Civil War style divisionist thinking that is currently fashionable).
I think all we can do is question what we see, and compare it against what we KNOW to be true. Which not everyone is capable of - e.g. who has the luxury of that kind of time? A great place to start, imho, is to recommend watching https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rStL7niR7gs.
We can, but we will need guillotines.
Well voting for the Capitalist party ain’t it. So start by NOT voting for the Capitalist parties, and then seeing what else you can do outside of the voting booth. But if you refuse NOT to vote for the Capitalist party, then do you really have a problem with the current system since you are actively supporting it.
I don’t follow you. They are BOTH the capitalist party, though not equally so. Also, voting for one side vs. the other does not mean that you agree with EVERYTHING that they do - in fact it is more common these days to vote against the other side and ignore what your own might plan or actually do. Nor is it true that avoiding voting - e.g. for mental or physical health reasons - means that someone does not care at all about what happens as a result of the election. Plus, a rather ENORMOUS fraction of people in the USA could skip a particular vote and it would not make the tiniest iota of difference, due to the electoral college system, though that heavily depends on where you live, and also trends to be more true the larger the region impacted (federal > state > county), whereas local elections could turn on a dime and also make a huge impact regardless of what goes on in upper levels - e.g. federal sends monies to help people but locals turn that aid away b/c “reasons”.
Unpopular opinion alert: I dare to say that many people who should NOT be voting - especially those who do little to no research beforehand - would vastly improve the outcome of elections by NOT voting, and thereby contribute more that way than they do now, by actually voting, where they tend to just magnify the votes of whatever the TV & radio talk show people (or more recently, pastors behind the pulpit) tell them to do. The latter makes the USA even more of a plutocracy than later, when the votes get ignored and the rich get whatever they want regardless of who got elected does.
You are missing the big picture. Capital benefits by people voting for either party of Capital. It doesn’t matter which one you vote for, important things like material conditions for real people will never improve if you vote like you are advocating. If you can’t even vote against Capital, then what good are you?