The sombre mien—that’s what stayed with me. On Saturday, Mark Carney looked less like a prime minister briefing media on trade negotiations than a wartime leader telling his country a feared turn had finally arrived and preparing them for a long ordeal. The intense, all-out effort to stop crushing new tariffs had failed, with Carney grimly explaining that the United States insists on “short-term transactions” rather than “long-term partnerships” and that its commitments could no longer be assumed to hold.
American demands reportedly went well beyond tariffs, market access, and sectoral protections. They targeted Canada’s freedom to set domestic cultural policy, interpret agreements it had already signed, and conduct trade relations with third countries. The loss of our sovereignty was too high a price for preserving economic integration. What prime minister would accept Canada becoming a vassal state on his watch? With the collapse of talks, and Carney describing the country as being “attacked,” it’s hard not to feel like we have crossed into a different moment—that we are living in a slightly darker reality.
Throughout the weekend, The Walrus spoke to economists, policy experts, and political observers about what exactly has changed and what this new period might demand of Canada.
from super easy to controversial:
EASY
100%-5000% escallating every time fuck face opens its fuck hole, tariffs on NET auto (and any other) sector trade balance. This means that a US firm importing auto (and other applicable sector(s)) parts gets a credit that they can transfer to any other US firm making auto parts, and the tariff level is only on the net trading balance.
Export tariffs on energy and any other vital US need. This makes money for Canada instead of costing Canadians.
tariffs/lawsuits/DST on US megatech services. FB just paid a bunch of US states for minor abuse.
CANCEL right fucking now all US defense purchases especially F35. F35s are pure shit. US must be made to beg for a deal that includes restoring commitments. Response that a fucking dime will be spent on US weapons is unacceptable gaslighting of Canadians.
Open invitation for US states to join as full provinces.
MEDIUM
Ban Maga-Larry Elison’s version of TikTok for ByteDance’s international version.
Only Huawei AI datacenters should be allowed. These provide close to 50% cost/performance benefit (ie cost half as much) and AI services can be exported to US to bankrupt their AI bubble. Restore general Huawei market access as preferred (cheapest/best) supply option.
Directly threated US exporters/tech to do what is needed to keep Canadian market access. Auto sector has received absurd subsidies they haven’t performed on. Nationalization through lawsuits designed to collect refunds for those subsidies is part of the threat matrix. With China’s help for Canadian benefit not more tax subsidies, figure out how to provide value products to Canadians from those factories. Negotiations with US oligarchy is only reliable counterparty, but fucking them over with an alternative, is how you negotiate.
Nazi/Zionazi empire and associated nazi economic theory (oligarchist corporatist supremacism promissing trickle down if you give them all your money) must be strongly criticized, if just for US midterms value, instead of our establishment/pig fucker rulers clinging to hope of returning to polite nazi colony status.
UBI is key to huge economic growth/investment in Canada, abandoning nazi economics. Removing foreign worker ban is key to reducing inflation, while keeping housing sector stable/increasing.
HARDER
US only exists because of Canada’s assistance with NORAD, and golden dome BS. Military cooperation with enemy is a disgrace, and not charging the US for NORAD services is us protecting them for free. This is only in the hard column for actually doing it. It is extremely easy to blah blah review committee to study doing it and disengaging with continued US military support.
Better diplomatic relations with every US adversary/enemy. North Korea can assist in a nuclear deterence plan against more US bs. DPRK balance can assist in ROK auto industry investments in Canada.
BRICS missile/drone tech can collapse US industry, and collapse US economically.
Abandoning support for Ukrainian nazis in favour of closer Russia ties. There is an affordability issue to supporting Ukrainians instead of Canadians, but it is a nazi colony issue to just keep every US enemy as our own.
International pressure to remove US from UN and NATO. Coordination for the purpose of collapsing the US government/economy, fleeing its debt and capital markets. The condemnation of nazi/zionaziism should be followed by economic consequences for midterms defined as defending nazi supremacism.
The core problem with Canadian response to first round of tariffs was to just gaslight inaction and wait around for more BS.
Export tariffs on energy and any other vital US need. This makes money for Canada instead of costing Canadians.
That’d disincentivize them from buying Canadian.
I suppose we could charge a carbon tax, though—say maybe $1000 a metric ton—maybe <90¢ a liter.
CANCEL right fucking now all US defense purchases especially F35. F35s are pure shit. US must be made to beg for a deal that includes restoring commitments. Response that a fucking dime will be spent on US weapons is unacceptable gaslighting of Canadians.
We don’t need overpriced American-military-industrial-complex crap.
Build nukes. Tell Trump and his MAGAts that the deaths:dollar ratios are almost irresistible.
Open invitation for US states to join as full provinces.
I oppose the monarchy and the Canadian political system. Maybe refer to Newsom as “The President of California.”
Directly threated US exporters/tech … is how you negotiate.
a bicycle for every Canadian; allow even smaller cars on the roads.
Nazi/Zionazi empire … polite nazi colony status.
Israel needs the US; the US doesn’t need Israel. This is even more the case with Canada.
UBI is key to huge economic growth/investment in Canada, abandoning nazi economics. Removing foreign worker ban is key to reducing inflation, while keeping housing sector stable/increasing.
possible migration deals with Mexico, Australia, UK, EU, EFTA, and Turkey.
Better diplomatic relations with every US adversary/enemy. North Korea can assist in a nuclear deterence plan against more US bs. DPRK balance can assist in ROK auto industry investments in Canada.
The Kim gang are buddies with Trump.
Better to make nuke deals with India, and if they aren’t interested, then Pakistan.
Abandoning support for Ukrainian nazis in favour of closer Russia ties.
Trump is pro-Putin.
Путін — хуйло!
Слава Україні!
Reduce protection on so-called “intellectual property” to 28 years.
What are the Americans going to do? Tariff records made in Canada?
That’d disincentivize them from buying Canadian.
export tariffs until at least mid terms affects US cost of living. There is a high shortage of diesel that requires Canadian crude, and even shortage of electricity/potash. (Those are the sectors export tariffs should apply) Pressure AB to put liquor ban, ffs
I oppose the monarchy and the Canadian political system.
Another solution would be A constitutional convention with any provinces and states that want to show up with goal of making a constitution in the process. Making a new country, or the threat of doing so, is a good discussion to include DNC on when they are facing rigged elections in 2 months.
Kim/Putin gang are buddies with Trump.
The nazi mainstream brainwashing is absurd on these points. Going so far as threats to Greenland are to gift it to Russia. US actively supporting Ukrainian terrorism on Russian oil for its own oligarchy. The main point is that our prosperity is impossible if we maintain nazi colony values of needing war against US enemies, while it is the US that corners the enemies with presidential concessions to them. What Trump has very successfully done is to isolate the world into individual cowards to be directly abused. Alliances with the non cowards is necessary to work around Trump’s dealmaking with them. The nazi colonial cowards all applauded “venezuela coup”, and will at best stay silent when more abuses of Canada occur.
When Canadian Politicans only hope is to return to a subjugated role in a unipolar demonic nazi “Rules based world order”, then decline/collapse of nazi master can only result in this lashing out against colonial vassals. The reaction of our politicians has only been how to lick the diaper more enthusiastically.
That’d disincentivize them from buying Canadian.
export tariffs until at least mid terms affects US cost of living. There is a high shortage of diesel that requires Canadian crude, and even shortage of electricity/potash. (Those are the sectors export tariffs should apply) Pressure AB to put liquor ban, ffs
Then some conservative pundits, or supposed pundits, attempt to assure that Canada wouldn’t keep it up after the mid-terms and when they’re proven right, such will embolden them.
If Carney put a 100% tariff until we went back to the presumably relatively more liberal trade under NAFTA, and held off well into 2027, that might have more effect.
Why are we boycotting wine from California and New York State?
For that matter, maybe have a sort of DEI for American companies owned by blacks, women, and/or of LGTs? Maybe allow imports of cans of beer provided they have pride colours.
Another solution would be A constitutional convention with any provinces and states that want to show up with goal of making a constitution in the process. Making a new country, or the threat of doing so, is a good discussion to include DNC on when they are facing rigged elections in 2 months.
Isn’t California’s population bigger than Canada’s?
Maybe give speeches on how California should separate. Californians are far more progressive and richer than red states. Red states hate women, LGBTQs, and people born in 1980 and after. They tried to start their own confederacy—a slave confederacy—but lost miserably to a Republican president who wasn’t even 60 years old—one who split logs and won wrestling bouts, rather than drive around in a golf cart—one who didn’t give 2 hoots if southern politicians didn’t like him.
Ah, 19th century Republicans—so strong and virile—unlike today’s wimpy Republicans who adore Robert E. Lee, Jefferson Davis, and Nathan Bedford Forest.
Texas as a Lone Star State?!? Hah! The secessionists split from Mexico because Mexico banned slavery, and Texans wanted slavery, and then spent 10 years trying to join the US, begging them to join. Then left again—make up your mind, Texans! Meanwhile the wp:Vermont Republic lasted 14 years! I’ll take a Green Mountain boy over a Texan Ranger—the former has more stamina!
The South’s gonna do it again—yeah, lose again.
Going so far as threats to Greenland are to gift it to Russia.
MAGA: Make America GO Away.
US actively supporting Ukrainian terrorism on Russian oil for its own oligarchy.
Ukraine is fighting for its existence as a nation.
Higher oil prices are perhaps more to Canada’s benefit than the US’s.
Ukraine is showing the world that one can hold off a big bully by fighting asymetrically.
The main point is that our prosperity is impossible if we maintain nazi colony values of needing war against US enemies, while it is the US that corners the enemies with presidential concessions to them. What Trump has very successfully done is to isolate the world into individual cowards to be directly abused. Alliances with the non cowards is necessary to work around Trump’s dealmaking with them. The nazi colonial cowards all applauded “venezuela coup”, and will at best stay silent when more abuses of Canada occur.
But we shouldn’t ally, or ally too closely, with dictatorships; nor, IMO, is such necessary. We should trade freely with all (or nearly all) nations, even if unreciprocated. China, Mexico, UK, EU, and even the US sell us stuff because they want Canadian money; but what good is Canadian money except to buy Canadian goods and services? But how can they get Canadian goods and services when their countries’ governments have stupid tariffs? They can’t eat Canadian money; nor trade Canadian money for other currencies unless those potential buyers of Canadian money value Canadian money, and for what again?: Canadian goods and services. No retaliation: the free market—the free market being something Trump and his billionaire sycophants aren’t well acquainted with—will do the retaliating—as it’s beginning to do, and while there are many politically stupid (and even generally stupid) Americans—numbering well in the 10s of millions—not all are.
If we—and by “we” I might as well include all non-Americans—can’t sell to Americans, we can’t get American money (or at least get far less), and thus we can’t buy American goods and services (or buy far less).
Let’s say before the idiot became President, an American could buy an American product for $100 and Canadian product for $90. Then their lord and master, their “god emperor” as 4chan put it, puts a 50% tariff—and the Canadian good rises to $135.
Americans will either pay the extra tax—the Trump tariff is a Trump tax on Americans—or buy the American product; but now the American producer has less incentive to produce better quality and lower prices. Indeed, they hike it to, say, $120. The American producer then gives $5 of that per unit sold, to bribe Trump. The Trump supporter says “Yes great god emperor Trump, abuse me more. I enjoy getting pushed by you.” while the average American grumbles and stews in anger.
Meanwhile, the Canadian company isn’t totally without customers, but still takes a bit of a hit and sells at perhaps $75 to another country and/or domestically, who might prefer it to the exported American product.
Americans grow even more weary with Trump, and his term isn’t even half over.
What is that saying? “For whom the gods would destroy, they first make mad.”
Doug Ford is a buffoon and a bit like Trump himself, but I’m enjoying him getting personal with the senile bully.
Ford has a longer term than Trump and when he finishes it he won’t even be a senior technically.
I somewhat expect the ridicule of Trump, his supporters, and the US to increase—a stupid President of a stupid people. Artermis is Trump’s to fail. Trump could use Ukrainian drones to deal with Iran, but he’s not interested because he perhaps hates Zelenskyy almost as much as he loves Putin and Kim.
Silicon Valley in the past seemed to have presented itself as aloof of politics and internationalist in scope. Their alliance with Trump makes them weak in this regards and shows how much the corporation is a creature of the nation-state—including, if you want, the fascist state. They have their gold, in their lairs, in pedophile islands, and golden parachutes, but their scores are highly exaggerated, and probably distasteful to the young entrepreneurs. Maybe those with OnlyFans accounts should maintain them as such are more dignified than working for these “tech bros.”
In our stupidity we made the “tech bros” rich: a few of them even fancy themselves as “trillionaires”, though their assets (e.g. wp:SpaceX) aren’t even 10% of their market caps—and methinks also that a lot of those “assets” are paper. An AI generated centerfold is probably more genuine than their corporation’s market cap.
Maduro was a dictator. I don’t miss his passing, nor has the US benefited much from the coup.
Perhaps no war the US has fought in the past 70 years has benefited the US—not even Afghanistan.
I’m pretty sure you’ve seen this:
US-Iran war explained by Chinese AI animation: Legend of the Valley of Gold
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=As0rplNJTZI
5:22
It’s CPC propaganda, but I still enjoy it. 😁 🙂
When Canadian Politicans only hope is to return to a subjugated role in a unipolar demonic nazi “Rules based world order”, then decline/collapse of nazi master can only result in this lashing out against colonial vassals. The reaction of our politicians has only been how to lick the diaper more enthusiastically.
If there is truly a “Rules based world order”, the US might have little to do with it, particularly with Trump as America’s HIIC.
Carlo Dade
None of this is new. Yet Canada, writ large, walked into the stadium without studying the game film of the opponent. Had we done so, little of what just transpired would have come as the surprise it apparently is. We would have known that the Americans would slip in an amped-up no-trade-with-China poison pill. We would have been prepared for it to arrive at the last minute, and we’d be working on contingency plans. Businesses could have readied (stockpiling goods, for instance). The media would have known, and they’d be hyperventilating less. Instead of a shock, it would have been a known worst case. We wouldn’t feel singled out. Our reaction would be calmer—we got punched when we weren’t expecting it, and we’re upset.
Either “writ large” is doing a lot of work there, or that’s just unfair. Anybody both not MAGA and following events was expecting this. Our negotiators definitely included.
The bit later on about communicating with the public suggests he did mean everyone else. To that, a whole lot has been written and said already about why it everything had to be secretive. Trump didn’t make a deal, but he wouldn’t even have gotten close if we’d been calling him out the whole time, and then you’d have the Conservatives saying Carney didn’t even try.
The nationalist, hit-back response—“we’re at war”—is based on emotion, not reason, and that plays into the Americans’ hand.
The only examples I can’t think of, where a nation at war downplays it, is where the war is a war of aggression they started. Spreadsheets and pie charts just don’t stir up the same will to sacrifice and defend.
At the other extreme, Vass Bednar is totally speaking our language:
What’s been missing, so far, is a strategy for technology and digital goods.
We were definitely expecting this, anyone who didn’t had their head in an unfortunate location.
Carney’s ace in the hole - the mid-terms in three months. It is very likely that if a trade deal is not signed soon, the Republicans will lose both the House and the Senate, and not just by a little. The myth that the tariffs will be ‘crushing’ to Canada just does not hold water. Tariffs on only $50 billion (both ways) out of total trade of $900 billion is certainly not going to break Canada, bit losing the Senate and House will devastate the Republicans.
One can almost count on the Democrats to foul up their chances to win both houses.
However, as Trump gets dumber, it might affect them in 2028.
Read the agenda. Vance will never let Trump last until 2928. .Vance wants to be POTUS without the need for an election, and he gets his wish it Trump is deposed at the mid-terms. Vance is just giving Trump enough rope to hang himself.
The way Vance is maneuvering, not even the Democrats could blow the chances of the House and Senate going Democrat. This is all about Republican voters making the shift, and they are doing it regardless of what the Democrats do or say. The Republicans want Trump gone more than the Democrats do.
As I posted elsewhere:
https://lemmy.ca/comment/25032971
The last time a GOP VP became President was in 1988—38 years ago, and Papa Bush served 2 terms with a popular US president who in his 2nd election won 49 states, 68.8% of the popular vote, and 213 more Electoral College votes than Trump did in his 2nd.
*I should have not posted 68.8% but rather 58.8%.
Presumably both Houses will go Democrat or they won’t.
If they do, Vance needs to do little because if Trump’s (successfully) impeached, Vance will get his job: though I suppose Vance could also get impeached too, and the (new) House Speaker becomes acting President.
As I think the Democrats won’t win both Houses, Trump will putter along. If Vance wants to strike, he will have to do in Trump’s 2nd half of the term to be able to be elected twice.
This is possible, but similar happened when Gerald Ford took office from Nixon in 1974, but he lost to Carter 2 years later—and like Reagan in 1984, Nixon in 1972 won bigger than Trump did in 2024.
% Electroral College votes # of states Nixon 1972 60.7% 520 49 Reagan 1984 58.8% 525 49 Trump 2024 49.8%[2] 312 31 + ME-02 and when Nixon won in November 1972, he wasn’t even 60 years old (unlike Kamala Harris who was 60 in November 2024).
Btw, how will this coup happen?
Will Vance assassinate Trump?
Invoke the wp:Twenty-fifth Amendment to the United States Constitution?
The wp:Second cabinet of Donald Trump seems to have 16 members. How many of them would rather have Trump finish to 2028 than Vance? Either way, they won’t be secretaries for long, but at least they might get more of their agendas more completed by 2028 with Trump than with Vance—Trump being the devil they know (or at least know more).
and, boy, what a ruckus will that turn into.
Could we have MAGAts field 3rd party candidates in 2028? Maybe some former Cabinet Secretary who stayed loyal to Trump? Maybe a Hegseth, Rubio, RFK Jr, even Bessent?
FYI, petroleum products alone are $120 billion, out of $400 billion total exports to them. That’s ~1/5 of all their oil. Although, to be fair, we get a lot of our refined fuel back from them.
Potash would be really hard for them to replace, and they were still buying our aluminum regardless of the 25% tax. Lots of their the other top imports are commodities, since that’s what we produce, and most commodities can’t just be made anywhere.
Obviously, they have the advantage of size. But if you look past that, at all, they suddenly don’t look so unstoppable.
So a 5% export tax on oil would return $12 billion? That pays for a LOT of the new tariffs Trump wants to levy/ The exporters drop their price by 50%, and the government pays the difference from the oil export tax. China actually did something like this when Trump tried to tariff them out of the market. Some of it was currency manipulation as well, but unfortunately the Canadian dollar is holding up, everything considered.
You vastly overestimate Americans. Very high chance nothing will change in the mid terms.
Yah, the more I hear about how how the GOP are going to get slaughtered, the less I believe it. Americans will just decide it’s in the bag and not vote, if the past is any indication. Fucking idiots.
It’s exactly how Doug Ford stays in power in Ontario, so we have nothing to be smug about.
It’s possible.
They pretty predictably punish whichever party has the White House for a bad economy, though. Or national embarrassment. Or, like, the weather on voting day. It’s pretty uniformly all blamed on whoever the president is, down there.
They’d better vote like their country depends on it this time. And the next. And the next. Because while money can’t buy everything, it seems to be able to buy selective amnesia in American news networks and voters’ minds.
Tell an American to ‘vote like their country depends on it’ and they will do the opposite. After all, isn’t that what Obama told them, and look how they voted?
I would never count on the Americans to vote intelligently.
Practically speaking, the Republicans have controlled the senate for 14 years. Realistically the mid terms are not going to change anything. The average American is more ignorant, self centred, and isolated than ever.
Six former Republican Senate seats are projected to maybe or definitely flip.
According to polls. People respond to polls who don’t vote.
I am sad to agree with you on this.
Today I looked to see if the Co-op had a Canadian brand of tooth paste, they did not that was going to be enough for me to write a letter, but than I noticed in the flyer they had a maple leaf by coke and pepsi. Angry I looked at a few other things and say they had maple leaves beside a lot of stuff that just was not Canadian. On the back of their products they advertise www.storebrands.coop which does not go anywhere, after confirming it was not storebrands.com I did a whois on it and found out that yes the coop owns it but its name is hosted by cloudflare. I will admit I hold a bias against cloudflare and suggested they fix the page and move to CIRA for their DNS. Since Carney has said we are at war with the US, sure it is a trade war not a pu pu boom war it is war none the less and I plan on fighting it.
I’m thinking of putting up lawn signs telling people to cancel Amazon, throw out Alexa, and cut Disney and Netflix.
Yeah, nah. Do all those things but it is a slippery slope to writing political opinions on a black Ram1500.
Obviously I’m not going to write my opinions on an American truck.
I wish I had the money to get rid of my apple home pods and replace them with some open source speaker/microphone. I have however got rid of the Apple Home and replaced it with Home Assistant, wish I got into it much sooner and replaced all of my apple things sooner.
I have a Mac Mini that has spent years sitting on my desk because I could not update it, I downloaded all my iTunes music purchases and than removed OS X and installed Debian.
I use pi-hole to block a lot of trackers and ads, and I self host a lot of things. In the next year or two I will replace my iPhone with a Motorola and either use e/OS or Graphen OS.
I’m curious, any reason for Motorola specifically? I would say they’re still a U.S. company, and in many ways no better than Apple.
I’d guess because Motorola has partnered with Graphene OS to release a phone with Graphene as the os.
Thanks! That makes sense, I did some research and was guessing the same thing.
I read an article a day or two ago that claims the Republicans are in trouble because so many Americans hate data centers. That and the trade war could spell trouble for a lot on the right.
You can read opinions and polls all day, the reality is only the right wing comes out to vote.
There’s a (slight) difference in turnout, and in vote efficiency, but there’s just more blue voters. In the end, the parties are balanced in the US, when it comes to the current process for elections.
I apologize for linking to a U.S. website, but here’s a polling average for the midterm for those curious: https://www.natesilver.net/p/generic-ballot-average-2026-nate-silver-bulletin-congress-polls
It looks like Trump’s party is indeed behind right now at least.
Polls are pointless. People respond to polls who never vote.
The polls seem accurate enough in the 2024 US Presidential election.
wp:2024 United States presidential election#Opinion polling and forecasts
But 2016 polls said it was a Clinton landslide.
wp:2016 United States presidential election#Exit poll seems to put it at:
Clinton Trump other 48 46 6
Nate Silver uses an aggregate of dozens of polls and weights each one based on numerous factors including historical accuracy and bias.
His model correctly projected Trump win in 2015 even when most polls said otherwise.
Lessons from the pointless forest, you don’t have to have a point to have a point. but all polls have a point spread.
They tend to get within 1-2% of the actual vote on election day, so I wouldn’t say pointless. They can certainly miss a tight issue, but trend lines are meaningful too.
Ouch. Those are really bad numbers for the GOP.
